Western Front: Would you like to see a greek system at WWU?

I would be concerned about elitism, or at least the diminishment of egalitarianism. These are things that I thought set us apart, as Vikings, from other state schools. That impression is part of why I came here. I don't know if the introduction of a greek system would create a class division, but these things would concern me. 

I agree with Pete... while it wasn't the selling point that made me choose Western over every other school I was accepted to (or ones that I didn't apply to, like UW), I saw Western not having a Greek system as a huge plus. When I think of Greek systems I think of exclusiveness/elitism- definitely not something I would want to be a part of. I think living in the dorms instead or just being a part of other, non-exclusive campus clubs/events allows you to get to know more people you may not have met otherwise, and I see this as much more important than being accepted into a selective sorority/fraternity.

I think it would be nice to have a greek system on campus. There is definitely a stereotype of partying and elitism with these systems, however, I think it could add another dimension to Western's campus life. There are people I know who have said that it would be nice if we did have a Greek system. I'm not sure if I would've rushed but i think it would be nice to see.

I'd say there's already enough douche bags running around as is. No need for more.

The fact that Western didn't have frats, was non-demoninational and seemed a totally laid back but not-a-party-school is what sold me (aside from the academics/location/cost/etc).

one of the main reasons i chose to go to western was because there was no douchy greek system

I wouldn't worry about so-called elitism. Frats are for the fake, wannabe elite.

Real elites go to med, grad, law, and b schools. Or have ridiculously rich daddies.

Frat boys to me are the epitome of Fail and Stoopid, anyway.

I think a Greek system could be good for this school.  A small Greek system, though.  Not too much.

But really, without the football games, what's the point?

Not every greek system is made up of elitist "d-bags".  Those who say they are have never been around a frat/sorrority, they just say that because they watch Van Wilder too much.  That said, I think not having one is one thing special about Western.  So no, I dont think Western should adopt the greek system.

The lack of a greek system is a definite selling point for Western and I wouldn't have it any other way.

The question is:  What would a frat/sorority mean at Western?

If it means social and economic elitism that would further stratify the university population, then I would be opposed to that idea.  However, I am not so closed minded that I believe that all of these systems are elitist.  It is the people that make up the organization that determine its direction and values, so with that in mind I believe a fraternity could exist at Western that eschews elitist values.

If Western truly values diversity, having a fraternity like the one described above would be a way to expand upon this theme.  I think Western has the type of social climate that could embrace and promote fraternities that do not exist solely on superficial foundations.

I must say that the lack of the greek system is definitly one that seperates Western from many other colleges. I grew in Pullman my entire life, home of the infamous WSU, and all I have seen from the greek system is just a lot of trouble for a lot of others on campus. During the week the average assult/rape ratio, that is reported, is 5/3, and thaton the weekends it is 3/1. These alone are the reported ones. Along with that WSU has had nermous groups of gang and hate violence generated from the people attracted to the greek system and has lead to many assults on LGBT's on the WSU campus, you may recall a student advisory letter from earlier this year. So I do not think that Western should have a greek system because even with a small one, it would completely warp the type of people this school attracts and prides itself on.

NO!!  Greek life is mostly for chuckleheads!  Drinking and screwing-- stupid people is the norm...why bring down IQ's at WWU??

Some of the houses I have seen off campus might as well be frat houses... Also, most Frats/Sorrorities require community service every month.  How many of you do community service? 

...don't you think?

Not having a greek system is definitely one of the reasons i was attracted to western in the first place.
and after watching a lot of my friends ruin their lives last year through the greek systems at other schools i have little respect for them anymore.

not to mention...where would the funding come from? our school (well any school really) already doesn't have enough money to continue programs that we already have. how would adding a greek system make that even better? our school didn't even have the money to continue our football team let alone establish an entire greek system.

I am going to be a freshman this year at Western, and from everything I have seen on TV and heard from older friends. I decided that while looking for colleges that I did not want a school with  greek system, which is why I prioritzed to either attend Western or Central, Western was my first choice.. yay me. But the point is, if Western had a greek system, I probably would not be attending Western in the fall.

I think choosing a college based solely on whether or not it has a greek system is a bad idea.

I definitely wish there was a greek system! I would have rushed, I think it's a good way to make friends and meet people. For me it's hard to make new friends because I'm so busy with school and I have to work for rent, books, utilities, food, ect. I was also a transfer student so I didn't live in the dorms. I've probably mentioned it 20 times to my friends and family on how I wish Western had a greek system.
P.S. not all frats are d. bags

What are the benefits of having those here? What is the down side? Dont forget to include all that in the article.

-----But I say the school doesnt need em.

A lot of the other responses seem to only address stereotyped Greek systems. My cousin at UC Berkeley is part of a sorority where no alcohol is permitted on the premise and guests are only allowed upstairs when escorted or the sorority loses funding from its national chapter. Overall, the sorority seemed to really be about sisterhood and involvement in the community. It sounded like the fraternities at UCB didn't have these sort of restrictions, but if WWU were to only endorse chapters with similar rules, I think they would be a great uniting factor for this campus.

So yes, I'd like to see a greek system on this campus if the chapters we sponsored were modest and controlled. I think, if done right, it could be a strong influence on furthering WWU's volunteer services in this community. Probably wouldn't have rushed as a freshman, but maybe as a sophomore once I got to see the greek system at work.

Absolutely not. The absence of fraternities and sororities was one of Western's major selling points for me. One argument in favor that I have heard is that it helps to establish a sense of community on campus. But without a greek system, students are encouraged to look for friends outside of their usual circumstances and I think it makes for a much more inclusive and diverse atmosphere on campus. If people were members of sororities or fraternities, regardless of the rules governing the individual group, I think it would throw up barriers to that kind of interaction that is so important to my experience of Western.

I think that a Greek system at Western could be really great. I know a lot of people from other schools with a Greek system and they are actually great people. Not all people who join the Greek system are a-holes. Many of them are intelligent and focused. While some people may have chosen Western because we don't have a Greek system, it wasn't their only reason for choosing to come here. I don't think that a Greek system would make or break a person's decision to come to Western, nor do I think if Western did get a Greek system that it would hurt future enrollment because we aren't like WSU or UW or any other school in the state. We have great programs, staff and people. People know that Western is a respected school in academics among other great qualities that Western possesses. We may no longer have a football team, which is a huge bummer, but there are other things that go on in frats and sororities that have nothing to do with sports in general and football in particular. Frats and sororities are a great way to make life long friends, help the community and network. Networking has become very important these days. Too often it's true that it's all about who you know and not what you know. I think that Western would benefit from having a Greek system. Besides, if someone doesn't want to rush, they don't have to. Rushing is by no means mandatory.

Before you can join a frat or a sorority, you have to get accepted to Western. Having a Greek system will not bring IQs of the school down (as someone posted earlier) because Western still has high standards for acceptance. I think that having a Greek system would actually make it more competitive to get into Western because more people may apply to get in because of the extra student activities that having frats and sororities would bring to our university. Western could maybe be even be pickier in their acceptance process because there could be more applications to choose from. People who are stereotyping people in frats and sororities as drunken fools and what not, should really be more open minded. At least if they won't be open minded and still want to think that all people part of frats and sororities are idiots9which they really aren't), then at least they'll know where to stay away from because all the people that they dislike because of what they've seen on tv or movies or because of a singluar negative experience will be crammed into one area of campus.

It's my opinion that having a greek system at western would not be a good idea. I agree with Pete and the others who mention that it would create a division and possibly even elitism among the students. I, too, am one who was drawn to Western because of the lack of the greek system (in addition to the other attractive qualities of the school). I am all for student involvement, but not when it involves division of the student body.

but it wouldn't survive.
The people in bellingham are the opposite of those in greek systems.  It would be very interesting to see.. for a week or two..

Fraternities and sororities are capable of organization.  For this purpose I think they're extremely valuable.  When people with common interests and political causes get together, it allows for a good time and better representation within the student government.  The frats and sororities could get together for social issues, friendly competition, volunteer groups, and potlucks.  It has the potential to be a good thing.

But it could also be costly.  As I'm sure many of you have witnessed, greek venues often become breeding grounds for self-destruction.  It would be a real bummer to have more of that than we already do.  Yeah, I say no-go.

"When people with common interests and political causes get together, it allows for a good time and better representation within the student government."

This idea sounds okay in theory, but I think these "common interest" groupings would quickly turn into cliques. I agree with what someone else said earlier in this forum post, that not having frats and sororities forces people to turn to alternative ways of meeting people. I think when people interact with those who have different values or interests it provides a good opportunity for healthy debate/dialogue.

we as a student body could do more community service. I have done some volunteer work, but it was not through a greek system.

No.

Cheers

Given the bleak employment anecdotes heard from the majority of my graduation cohorts, I'd say further professional networking opportunities could be a welcome addition to this university.

NO greek system at western. it would divide students while bringing together others, not worth it. western is cool as is. I liked western because it was so laid back and having a greek system would make things all about status. 

Earlier somebody mentioned something about cliques forming because of a greek system. From that notion it sounds like you are saying they don't form on their own. I think that cliques form all over the places, inevitably. So I don't think that a greek system could further harbor this type of behavior. Now though I have already said my piece earlier on the greek system I just wanted to point out that it won't stop division of the student body, it already is divided. But I think with western we have bridges that connect these divisions between us, and it is possilbe that greek system could burn some of those bridges down.

There is also something to be said of tradition, it has been the tradition at wwu to not have a greek system.

So far, and I am not being critical, I have not found any real evidence on this thread that we need a greek system. It would seem that the arguments the pro-greek side of this debate are presenting are organizational benefits.

Western has a really great and open access system for clubs, meaning it is very easy for a group of students (small or large) to organize and recieve funding for a wide variety of clubs (or at least, this is my understanding). I feel that this is a very good thing. But, a greek system on campus might threaten that diversity/versatility. If a greek organization was brought into the picture, especially one with a large and historic organizational structure that was designed to dominate student government and the appropriation of funding, then the tradition of diverse and accessable clubs on campus could be threatened. I don't know if the puddle jumping club could compete for funds from a major nationwide greek club that is experienced in lobbying student government for funding.  

One concern I have would be how a Greek system would impact the community. Frats and sororities are based on gender roles-- you're either male for one or female for the other. This could pose a problem for students who don't identify strictly as either male or female.

Another concern is the inherent elitism Greek houses tend to exemplify, regardless of whether they're asses or genuinely nice people. No matter who you are, you're going to want your house to be the best, and you're going to accept the people you think would fit into that particular mold. Not a bad concept by itself, but I could see it quickly degenerating into classist battle. People who have the most money to contribute will be the most wanted for rush. Even if you ignore the money issue, Western is a rather relaxed school. A Greek system would inevitably add an air of competition. Do we want that?
 
Of course, there are solutions to these problems-- it's just a matter of whether a Greek system would be as inclusive as we purport the rest of Western to be, or whether it would fall back on the stereotypes of Greek systems we're so familiar with.

but I second the above ^^^^^^

well said

I definitely see where you are coming from, Scotty-O, and that's an excellent point. I didn't mean to imply some students naturally don't form cliques, but I think you put it nicely that it would essentially exacerbate the problem.

i like to party, and frats n soroitys would be awesome...

Thank you for your response, jacksoe3, and I was not thinking your ignorant of the fact, just felt it would be good to anybody else reading the thread to make sure they realize that. This has been an excellent discussion :)

It's hard to say whether fraternities and sororities would be a good or a bad thing, since I'm not sure how it would change Western. But that being said, I like the school how it is, and I'm not sure if the benefits of having frats and sororities would outweigh the potential things that could go wrong. Western isn't a huge party school, which it seems to me that greek houses are known for being at other schools, and for me that was part of why I loved the school. Not that parties are bad or anything, but people seem to be able to throw parties without a greek system. I would hate to see some of the bad situations with hazing and verbal abuse or whatever that you read about in magazines go on at Western, and have that assocaited with the school.
So I guess that even though a greek system would do good with having people do community service, like people mentioned, there is a lot of bad stuff that could potentially go along with that which I wouldn't want to see at our school.

And I probably would not have pledged as a freshman. I had enough fun in my dorm :]

I feel as though the main focus of a fraternity or sorority is to build fellowship and support among a group of members. Western is filled with groups/organizations/clubs/communities that already accomplish this goal. In fact, the AS recognizes over 200 clubs each year; talk about finding a place to belong! Look how the class are separated by which department one is in, or the programs that residents take part in based on which residence halls one lives in and is a part of. So what other services would a greek system provide  for our campus? I believe it may result in hazing (which is not only a crime in Washington, but is definitely not supported nor tolerated at Western). Just because it is against policies, does not mean it will be followed. It would probably lead to hazing being underreported in most cases, and this may cause many of the actions within fraternities and sororities be secretive to those who are not members of them. And if the hazing was not to be reported, it'd be difficult and even impossible to confront and enforce.

Western staff, faculty, alumni, and students take pride in the diverse and inclusive communities that foster active learning, leadership, social responsibility, civic engagement, and effective citizenship here at WWU. I hope it stays that way!

There are enough schools already that have the Greek system. Schools like Western that don't have them are a little more rare. While it's not a big deal to me, I get the impression that some people really like not having the Greek system. Some people do like it, but like I said, there are a lot of schools out there that do have it. If you really want the Greek system, go somewhere else. There actually are other schools besides Western, believe it or not.

I definitely think that Western is better off without a Greek system. For me, it was the calmer atmosphere that really attracted me to Western and Bellingham. I feel like adding a Greek system would throw that vibe off a lot and really undermine all the reasons I feel attached to this place.

Sure why not. As long as I dont suffer from it.

I saw it at UW and it was awful. The Greek system encourages only ridiculous drinking and makes young girls prey to very stupid people. I like western because we don't have one. Any responsibilities or function they may provide could be carried out by anyone who would volunteer. What do they even do anyway? Don't people go crazy enough in the dorms?

So that's just one more no I guess

Animal House.

 NO!

NO

 I, too, have enjoyed not having a greek system here at WWU. However, wouldn't it be fun to see a sorority or fraternity full of WAY AWESOME people? Like what if the women of Women's Empowerment And Violence Education made a sorority or Western Men Against Violence made a fraternity? Or what about a transgendered greek house? I know its wishful thinking but wouldn't that be cool to have a greek system that challenged traditional greek system rules and stereotypes?

 I am an incoming freshman to WWU and I am proud it does not have a Greek System. The Dorms offer enough community and so do the AS clubs. I do not want WWU to ever have a greek system. True movies and t.v. fabricate the horrors of the Greek system, but there has to be some truth. The Greek System is stereotyped to be all about partying, hazing and elitism. Why would we want to risk that ever happening to WWU? Yes, a Greek System might encourage more competitiveness, but WWU already has high standards. How much more stress needs to be added to students wanting to become a Viking? 

I'll admit that the benefit of a Greek System is that it offers a smaller community to those students how need a more home like environment. The dorms, suite style rooms and such offer that closer knit community. The Greek System is out of place for WWU.