Greek Houses: It's Time.

Just keeping the point short, but the school not having a greek system was a big deal to me in trying to decide where to attend, and I know I'm most certainly not the only one.  If participating in a greek system is what you want out of a university, there are plenty of others in the state you can attend. 

Interesting point, Isherwa.  I'm not sure I understand your position--however, I am not advocating that people be beaten over the head and forced to join a house.  If you don't want to join an organization, you don't have to!

Ultimately, whether or not a school has  a Greek system is perhaps not the best way to base someone's choice of a school (not to criticize you--I'm sure you had lots of reasons.) Were I to switch schools solely on the existence of a Greek system, I'd say I probably didn't deserve to attend college in the first place.

Just go to UW or WSU

I think the thing about state universities is that they should offer varieties. If every state University was U-Dub, then it wouldn't matter where we really went. It is, however, because each University offers something different to students that many people choose one place over another. The State has universities with a Frat system and for those who are not interested in that we have Universities that don't have a frat system, WWU is just such a Uni. I disagree with the assessment that we need to switch over to a Frat System; there aren't any potential benefits that are necessary; the culture and environment of WWU is such that we don't need the camaraderie  offered by a Frat, the clubs and organizations that we have more than make up for a lack of Frat/Sort system, and in my opinion is better.

Elitism and Douchebaggery are the sterotypes of the Greek system and are often the first impressions and first impressions are typically lasting ones. Elitism and douchebaggery are the last sort of lasting impression I want of the school I go to

Edit: Also, hate to be an ass here but Animal House/Old School aren't satires, they're parodies. A parody is when you take X and use it to make fun of X and is often lowbrow. Satire is taking X and using it to make fun of Y, and often requires intelligence on the part of both the writer and the viewer. I apologize for bringing up such a dumb  thing, but next to misuse of irony, misuse of satire bothers me the most :P

Neither UW, nor WSU have a program like the VRI here at Western, which is why I came here. Had there been a Greek system in place here, I'm sure I would've pledged too. In addition to a Greek system, I would've really enjoyed having a ROTC detachment here, but that's very unlikely to ever happen.

was also an important factor for me. whetther i choose to join a sorority or not, it is still going to influence my life here and thats why western not having one is important to me.  most people here are against it, which is why it continous to get shut down in voting every four years.

Western used to have a greek system....hence the names of houses on the Ridge. However I think it was in the 60s when the student body voted to shut them down....

So Cesky, it's been done here. And I agree...if that's something you want, why would you come here anyway?

"So Cesky, it's been done here. And I agree...if that's something you want, why would you come here anyway?"

Uh... maybe becaus there are more important factors than whether or not there is a greek system

 I think it would actually be very fun to have the greek system back at Western. There are many negatives of the system, but I think they encourage good things too!

You may want to take a look at this link to get some other opinions: http://forum.wwu.edu/node/6239

I'd have to agree with many people on this issue, I could have gone to UW, but I decided on Western for several reasons. One of the big reasons was that it lacked a Greek system. I understand there are benefits and good that can come out of these arrangments, but I prefered not to be involved in them, and not to be in an environment where they persisted. I know there is a sterotype and not all parts of a greek system are subect to its connotations, but I think the system necessarily brings with it division, elitism, hostility, and an archaic sense of heirarchy and brotherhood. Join a club or volunteer instead if you want to share interests and be involved with a community. There are lots of other options to seek community interest and opportunities.

I also want to mention I don't think there ever was a Greek system in place at Western. The Ridge buildings, as far as I know, were only named with Greek letters while being built so workers could distinguish them. I don't think it has anything to do with fraternities or sororities.

If the voice of campus speaks in favor of the Greek movement, then go for it. However, I would be one to vote against it.

What I don't understand is that this University is filled with hippies and liberals who pride themselves on "social progress" who think they ARE more elite because they dont have these sorts of things.

The REAL progressive thing to do would be to allow Fraternities and sororities and make them in a different light. Show that they aren't just a bunch of douche bags, and uphold a large standard. For instance, a school regulations that require certain things and that are inspected on a monthly basis by school officials etc.

That to be would be the ultimate "liberal and progressive thing" that all these damn hippies hold their heads so high about.

Liberals and hippies are the MOST elitist of all.

Well Matt I think your bias towards anyone "liberal" or who is a "hippie" seems to be clouding your view. It all boils down to this: whether some people hate the greek system, and some people really want it at Western, a student vote has shut it down. So essentially, Western has done the "progressive thing" - vote. If a vote from the student body said no to the greek system, that means that most people don't see it as a necessary addition to our campus. So instead of railing on hippies and liberals, take a step back. Your fellow students voted no to the greek system, and last time I checked, democracy was a pretty fair and established method to tackle issues. If you are worried about putting a good light on the greek system, let's put the issue to a student vote again. If it passes, then let the Western community create a great and innovative greek system. And if it doesn't pass, then it will have confirmed what we know now - most students don't want it or don't care to have it here. There are many ways to be progressive, but voting is the fundamental stepping stone. And that vote has spoken.

How many years ago was this vote done?

Secondly, the people who pride themselves on being "anti-frat" dont take the time to THINK about the possibilities, just because they want their way.  I feel like a general concensus vote for this issue is not the most efficient way. I am interested to see what the results would be nowadays... I feel like they would be very close indeed.

Hippies and liberals' minds are clouded with their drug-induced dazes and socialist ideals.

I don't remember what my source of this information, but i think that a vote has been held every 2 or 4 years since the 1960's or something.  I wish i remember where i heard that from.  Anyone else know?

And stop your blanket statements, Matt.  The world is not seperated into just two categories. 

 Who cares if there is a greek system? Honestly, I highly doubt any of you would even notice. I am the first family member not to be a member of a house and I personally know that they do a lot of good for the community. They also do a lot of activities on campus for everyone. 

So lets not hate on the greek system. Be open-minded. 

And PLEASE never say that you chose WWU because they don't have a greek system again. That's the most pathetic thing I have ever heard. 

So, you must agree with Prop 8, right?

You're making a statement without support. You assume that the 'hippies' and 'liberals' aren't thinking about the issue, and you know what they say about assuming. In addition you're telling us that Hippies are X and Y and that Hippies and Liberals do X and Y and you are wanting a greek system, meaning you are representing those people who would join a greek system and your representative is a poor one. So when people think of why they don't want to have a greek system here they need to look no further than your posts to be reminded. If you want a greek system here, rather then bash on those people who voted against, why don't you give a better and well thought out plan like the OP, which, while there may be dissenting opinions, at least it was well written and did not attack a particular group.

And Clark if Cesky had more important factors to look into when determining a university and a Frat was not necessary to come here, then logically a Frat is not needed.

I'm personally in favor of the greek system but theres a hitch in all this anyway.  It's a municipal rule that no more than 3 unrelated people can live in one dwelling.  If you look at western's room share boards theres no 4+ bedroom postings.  Though alot of people ignore it, I doubt getting a charter would be easy if a house was illegal

i was told by a senior, at discovery days alst year, that the votes were done every 4 years.

and btw. people arent saying that they only reason they came to western in because of the lack of a greek system just that it was an important deciding factor. the same goes for schools with greek systems, some people are really into them and wouldnt want to go to a school where that isnt an option.

I think it's really awesome that the creator of this thread put down people who don't want Greek houses for stereotyping and simple-minded thinking, and then Mr. Matt here says that all liberals do drugs and like socialism. Hilarious!

There you go again, hiding behind a smokescreen of bourgeois cliches.

My comment has nothing to do with if we should have a Greek System or not, but to clarify that the dorms on the Ridge are not named as such for a past Greek system. When they were building the Ridge, the contractors gave them greek alphabet names because it was easy for them to remember. 

"Hey Bob, go work on the plumbing in Beta."

Who knows why they went with Greek letters instead of numbers, but THAT is the truth. And, like a lot of things here at Western, they were never renamed (much like the AIC) and those Greek letters stuck.

And thus, I am pretty sure WWU has never had a Greek system, so there.

First off, I love the rhetoric that gets thrown around in forums. Hilarity.

Second, I'd just like to support those who considered whether or not their prospective universities had Greek systems when choosing where to go for college. The impact (or lack) of fraternities and sororities is huge on a college campus, both for the better and for the worse. It affects the campus environment, student involvement, leadership programs... the list goes on. But even though I'm personally in support of the Greek community, I totally recognize that it isn't supported by this community.

Just because people don't want a Greek system doesn't mean they "haven't really thought about it" or are "hippies" or "liberals." There's nothing inherently wrong with fraternities or sororities. This much is obvious. Colleges with a Greek system and colleges without are different colleges. Not better or worse, just different. Some people prefer one or the other. I certainly would prefer to do without. I like the environment of the campus as it is.

Hey Locke, thanks for pointing that mistake out for me; there's a big difference between John Belushi and Volataire.  Fix'd.

Anyway, I do understand that we don't NEED a Greek system, per se; I'm afraid I have no argument to counter the statement "I just don't want one."  I have, however, talked to just as many people who have wanted to go to WWU, but were put off, to some extent, by the lack of a greek system.  In some ways, I agree with your assessmennt in the need for variety, but the existence of one social club doesn't mean that the university is any less diverse.  For example, almost every university you find in Washington will have, say, a basketball team, or at least intermural sports teams of some sort.  That doesn't make the university any less diverse.  Why would the existence of a Greek house be any different?

I noticed this as well.  No one's more discontent with the military than me, but I really would be happy to see the ROTC here.  Diversity rocks, and even if I disagree with the military, I totally respect them for what they're doing.

Because, as I have said, there are more important things to a university than a Greek system.  For example, one of my favorite sports is kendo.  Western Washington does not have a kendo club; despite this, I came here anyway.

Thank you so much, good to have someone agree with me. :)

I think your statement about liberals and hippies being elitist is a little bit of a generalization, but on other topics I agree with you.  I really want to challenge the prevailing stereotype on campus, and hopefully this is an openminded enough environment for me to do so.

I've neither heard nor seen anything relating to a vote, but I've only been here for a couple years.

I agree with you; Matt, please think before you make stereotypes.

The university's student body doesn't have to vote on whether or not we create, say, a kendo club.  Why should they have to vote on a bunch of people living in a house together?

Finally, someone who gets it.  I am in almost exactly the same position as you--both my parents were in Greek houses.  I wanted to continue the tradition, but I opted to come here because of excellent academics and a great campus community.  I thought that it would be easy to start a Greek house, but apparently not.

HOLY REDUCTIO AD ABSURIDIUM, BATMAN!

On the other hand, though, I do think you have a point.  Popular vote isn't always the best thing, and there have been numerous examples in history reinforcing your feelings.  I wouldn't have used your words, but I do for the most part agree with you.

I never said that, I just said that there are other possibilities than the negative examples people bring up.  I am not making judgements here, so I trust you not to do so either.

Thank you for your recognition.  With respect to the end of your post, I agree with you in that a frat system is not needed, in the same way that sports teams are not needed.  We still have those, however.  Therefore, by your own reasoning, if we don't have frats, then we shouldn't have sports teams or other social groups, as they are not needed by the university, and the existence of one shouldn't necessarily influence choice.

That sounds a little off to me.  Just saying.

Rules can be challenged.  I never said it would be easy, I just said it would be possible.

First, you need to define "Greek House."  Were we to start something on this campus, we would have to start out small, so as to minimalize the impact.  I don't see much impact with just another crowded house out on Indian street.

Is it really necessary for you to try and turn this into a political issue by ranting about the all the "hippies and liberals?" I think as far as most people are concerned, whether or not you're a Democrat or a Republican has absolutely nothing to do with whether or not you want the Greek system here. So please, lets try and keep this post on topic.

I think a greek system would be cool, They do a lot of good for the community and I for one would be relieved to have a place to party and not worry about getting an M.I.P.

Ha.

If there's not going to be much of an impact and it'll be just another crowded house on Indian Street, then what's the point in the first place? You can't say "I think this campus could use fraternities and sororities" and then go back and say "Having fraternities and sororities on campus wouldn't really affect it that much." Well, obviously you can, but it doesn't make much sense to me. :p

Wow, that's rude.  I 100% agree with isherwa that the fact that WWU was large enough (yet not too large) and academically focused enough without a Greek system was a major drawing factor for me.  It seems to be rare these days to find this large of a school without a Greek system.  I have zero interest in partying and the fact that a school has its values based on that (lack of partying, but instead focusing on academics) made me choose an OUT-OF-STATE school.  As a side note, my home state has more than enough large partying schools to satisfy all of your partying needs.

I enjoy the fact that you are a hypocrite in your speech.  "Be open-minded"  Ummmm...The last time I checked "that's the most pathetic thing I have ever heard" was considered rude and closed minded.  I don't know though.  I could just be so pathetic because I care about academics more than partying AND sports to know any better.  The way I see it is if our school can choose to spend money on academics instead of on football, I have chosen the right school.

I persoanlly think that NOT having a Greek system makes our campus special and unique. There aren't a lot of large state universities that don't have Greek systems. I also don't particularly like the idea, and can't see how it would make our campus better in any way.

I am not going to say that Greek houses promote sexism, but they DO promote heteronormative activites and quite often exclude LGBT students. Greek houses are, by their nature, NOT gender-neutral. Where do you propose Transgender students who would like to pledge a Greek house go? WWU already doesn't have any gender-neutral housing, why add oen more thing that will exclude people?

A couple other things derived from reading other comments:

The Ridge was not at any point Greek houses. Usually Greek systems start in already built houses. The Ridge was built to be residence halls. You can tell if you've lived in them. They just have Greek letters for names.

Also, if you think that living in a Greek house will keep you from getting in trouble with the police, you are sadly mistaken. While I realize that comment may have been made in a joke, it still bugs me, probably because I am an RA on campus. If you live in a Greek house, you are still technically living off campus, and the Bellingham PD has jurisdiction. Not that I'm saying you can get away with breaking the law if you live ON campus. My point is you really can't get away with it anywhere, including in Frats. My advice? Just don't break the law.

Jords27, along with a few others, commented that Western used to have a Greek system because of the names of the buildings on the Ridge. Actually, they were named by greek letters during construction so they would not be mixed up, as many of them look fairly similar. The plan was that whenever someone donated a large sum of money to Western, they would get one of those buildings named after them. Apparently, we never received that much of a donation. So THAT is why they are named like that, not because we used to have a Greek system. Please do your campus history before you comment. Oh yeah, and I agree, I came to Western because there was no Greek system, and most certainly would not like that changed.

do you realize that what you are ssaying, is that a greek system would infuence and encourage illegal activities....?

that is probably a big reason for the administration to not have one in the first place, this was even pointed out in the Western Front a couple days ago.

Just go to a college that has the greek system. Western's better off without it.

No.

I fully agree. wether or not i would join a sorority i believe that they are great ways to make great bonds and find groups of people similar to yourself. and if Western is going to live up to the "hippy-school" persona we tend to give off, we shouldnt be finding ourselves being so judgemental and close-minded.

lets face reality, some does not equal all. and MINDS ARE LIKE PARACHUTES, THE FUNTION BEST WHEN THEY'RE OPEN!

I liked the idea about a gender neutral house.

For some of us who didn't get into UW (and have no slight interest in going to WSU), I think a frat/sorority system would be a good option for housing. Out of state tuition wasn't an option either so don't go there.

Of course you could make an unofficial 'frat/sorority' off campus and not have to deal with any of the campus police/issues.

Yes, because that is ALL I care about. Not all schools with Greek Systems care only about parties and sports. UW is Washingtons top school and surprise surprise they have a greek system. UPS is also a very good school when it comes to academics and it's small and it has a greek system.

Walk down Indian on a Friday night, you will find just as many drunk kids at parties as you would at WSU or UW.